The Specter of Estrogen Dominance

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uh oh okay let me got
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it oh now my uh slides aren’t moving oh there we go okay first of all I want to
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talk about the Pioneers in this field Dr John
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Lee and Dr Karina Dalton why I want to speak about them specifically is be
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partially because of the diametric differences in their
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philosophies so Dr John Lee wrote this book natural progesterone as he retired
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from his practice towards the end of his years he took the work of dror Ray Pete
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who was a physiologist and um biochemist who studied progesterone
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directly so Dr John Lee uh used progesterone in his practice and
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reported positive rep uh results for a 100 patients in the treatment of
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osteoporosis for those patients he wrote this book which I think if you’ve never
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looked at it it’s a very good primer on um progesterone and its activities so Dr
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Lee had a couple uh things that he was quite adamant about one was that your
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body produced no more than 20 milligrams of progest so that ought to be your
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dose which um is confounded by when you
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put hormones into your body unless you’re directly injecting it you only
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absorb a portion of that dose you don’t absorb the whole thing so if you were
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really low in progesterone and use 20 milligrams um you could very well
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depending on the cream base absorb maybe one milligrams something very very small
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he also was a strong proponent of saliva
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testing one of the things we know about saliva testing when you are
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administering a topical Preston those results are going to be
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Sky High on saliva the companies that offer saliva
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testing will give you a normal range for untreated um people for hormones but
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then they’ll Al also give you a second higher range for
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treated um to to evaluate those who are treated and where does that higher range
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come from uh this is not a scientific concept this is something that’s made up
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by the lab partially to accommodate the fact that those levels in the saliva are
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going way up but it’s not Cor ating with clinical
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response so let’s move on here so um he defined estrogen Damas he
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is credited with giving us this def definition and basically your estrogen
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can be deficient it could be normal it can be high but that it’s the ratio
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between the estrogen and the progesterone that makes you have more
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estrogen symptoms to the point of a lot of discomfort and a lot of chronic
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problems I’m talking about that 20 milligrams I decided to do a deep dive
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on his 20 milligram issue and I looked all over
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the place and tried to find original research that said 20 milligrams was
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produced by the human body and I finally emailed Dr Ray Pete
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and uh he said for one thing if you check the output in the uterine vein you
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get 100 milligrams his uh supposition that 20 milligrams is somehow a upper
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limit for progesterone is is rather
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faulty so prior to Dr John Lee now we have this book was
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published in the 50s but she published some of her research sooner Dr Katarina
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Dalton and she is the woman who first characterized PMs and not only did she characterize
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the symptom of symptoms of PMS she developed treatment which was
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progesterone and progesterone was used in very generous doses she started out
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with injectable as I mentioned before that’s going to be completely usable uh she
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eventually switched over to suppositories and the suppository doses
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would be something like 400 to 600 milligrams suppositories applied
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vaginally or applied rectally so her doses were
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considerable so the work of Karina dalon was the basis of what was happening at Women’s
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International Pharmacy we sort of we embrac the work of Karina Dalton and
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Joel harrove and Wayne Maxon uh along with a compounding
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pharmac pharmacist devised a oral progesterone in
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oil and demonstrated that you could get appreciable blood levels you could get
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ludal phase blood levels if you used at least 400 milligrams a
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day what was uh interesting about uh about this is now we’re using some
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really really large doses of progesterone and in those PMS patients
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we dealt with some severe uh symptoms we dealt with Suicidal Tendencies we we dealt with
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huge headaches one of the things we found was a starting dose with those oral encapsulations were 400 milligrams
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a day divided doses um but sometimes that wasn’t
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enough and which case women used more and we even developed other dosage forms
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we developed suppositories we developed lozenges rectal Solutions creams gels
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what have you to get to a place where progesterone could handle all of the
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symptoms of PMS not just
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some here’s a little schematic where Dr Dalton um was trying to point out that
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progesterone receptors are all over the body and here we are quite a lot of
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years later where I think uh this needs revision we have progesterone receptors
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all all over the place and um needs to be taken into consideration when when
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you’re thinking about how much progesterone does somebody need to make
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to to reach a point of
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comfort I want to bring this up too and uh probably every here everybody here is
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familiar with this graph this style style wiseed graph which the problem
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with this and it’s often the case is that the units of the hormones are
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not um demonstrated so we have estral but these
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levels of estral are in picograms per M and Prestons in nanograms per Mill A
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Thousand Times Higher so imagine if you will that that curve for progesterone is
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a thousand times the um estrogen one of the big things here that I think is
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often overlooked is in the follicular phase that progesterone primarily comes
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from the adrenal glands and it’s not a flat near zero line it’s it has
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substance when you multiply that line times a thousand you’ll see you’re Way Beyond the amount of estr being
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produced just just to uh verify that um I just pulled some uh lab ranges for for
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labs just to reinforce that progesterones and nanograms over picograms for estral this
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is really important so I think that graph has minimized the importance of
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progesterone in many many people’s
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minds so when we have a in excess we have all these symptoms these are a few
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common ones headaches breast tenderness leg cramps gallstones
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fibroids vaginal bleeding uh there are
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700,000 uh hysterectomies done per year in the United States a good major
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proportion of those hysterectomies are performed for excessive vaginal bleeding
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this is pretty dramatic
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thing so after working with women’s
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International Pharmacy I I no longer had this direct patient contact that I I had
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so many uh patients teach me so I decided to go to Facebook and Facebook
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is where you’re going to find your failures there are support groups all
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over the place you’ll find many many women and men who have gone to doctor
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after doctor after doctor with this kind of constellation of symptoms and have
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been unable to find
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relief so I’m going to present a case and this is uh p
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pmdd and the history of pmdd is very interesting and I I have a paper
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documenting some of that but in the late 90s proac uh was running out of their
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patent protection and they were seeking to have a new indication for their drug and they
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put together a um study and showed that women had some improvement with their
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moods symptoms during the ludal phase they were
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essentially um capturing or trying to capture those severe pmss as Dr Karina
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Dalton had already characterized and move this into another treatment plan um
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at the time this was happening I thought well this isn’t going to go anywhere because progesterone works so
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well but to my surprise I found that this alternative treatment
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is entrenched in conventional medicine so this is what uh those women with
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severe PMS or pmdd premenopausal dysphoric disorder
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are being faced with first they’re put on ssris and uh that doesn’t work very well
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then they’ll get put on birth control pills then Gat a tropen blocking agents
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to wipe out all your hormones and incidentally when they do that they give you back estrogen and then when that
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fails as well they decide to uh relieve you of your organs so you’ll have a
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complete hysterectomy and ectomy so these women are being told
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that they are sensitive to Progesterone and they should avoid it at all
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costs and so a a woman with this
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diagnosis has gone all the way through this and yet she still has those
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symptoms driven by that extra estrogen she’s being given and they will be on a
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cluster of drugs they’re suicidal anxious angry tender breast insomnia
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weight gain and they’re they use a lot of drugs they’re using benzos they’re using
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anti-depressants they can’t sleep all signs of too much estrogen and certainly
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not enough progesterone because they’re being denied their
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progesterone so on one of these Facebook pages the estrogen dominance support
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group um they are talking about an interesting phenomen phenomenon they
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call the estrogen Kickback and this occur occurs when the
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dose of progesterone is given and all symptoms it seems of estrogen are
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increased now John Lee did recognize this way back when and he said at the
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conference when uh women were taking proest and experiencing exactly that
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they couldn’t stand the small 16 milligrams of progesterone and they would be anxious
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and panicky can’t sleep and Dr Lee said oh well no matter
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you just continue to take that dose and by nine months it will have
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disappeared from the Katarina Dalton point of view we can make those symptoms
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disappear very quickly we called it um
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breakthrough we had breakthrough symptoms and if you give more progesterone and give it right away um
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even every 15 minutes whatever it is you have you can entirely flip those
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symptoms and this continues to be a real problem with using progesterone too many
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doctors are being trained to use too little progesterone they make their
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patients worse the patients leave they have no sense that they are creating
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some real problems these patients become convinced that they cannot use
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progesterone so one of the things I think about when you’re faced with these
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estrogen dominant symptoms and you’re using progesterone progesterone has so much
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work to do uh John Lee also said that that
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progesterone stimulates estrogen receptors for estrogen and that was
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causing what um they are calling the estrogen Kickback however when I look
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this up I I find little evidence for this actually happening nothing strong
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that I could give you and I don’t know if some of this estrogen balance is
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because of receptor activity or is it some sort of yin-yang situ ation that
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the activity is in opposite directions and somehow balance each other out it’s
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a real conundrum not strong evidence that I’ve been able to find then um
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progesterone is an immediate precursor to hydrocortisone so what happens if you
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are low in hydrocortisone that you’ve had either an acute big stress or
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chronic long-term stress and your hydro cortisone is simply low does
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progesterone fill it in I would imagine it is but there are people that argue
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that somehow pregnanolone is diverted to make more hydrocortisone somehow leaving
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progesterone out of the equation I don’t know if that’s true or not um but I do
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know that when you use progesterone you may help the adrenals
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with the hydrocortisone or you may help the adrenal simply on the basis that
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progesteron and adrenal hormone and as I said before in the
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folicular phase it’s no small amount of progesterone it’s a large amount um progesterone along with
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pregnanolone is synthesized in the Schwan cells all the nervous system in
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tissue in your body are um
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subjected to this production of pregnanolone and progesterone and used
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right there we’re never going to see those levels on any lab tests they’re
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used up immediately the nice thing uh that happens is that if you use progesterone
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exogenously you can get some results with nerve cells I was at a conference
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um it was Pharmacy conference and I spoke to one of the uh speakers later in
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the day at a reception and he told me during his presentation he was afraid he
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might fall over because he could not feel his feet and I gave him some progesteron to
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rub on his feet for the night and he came back in the morning and he said
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what have you done to me that dose of progesterone allowed him
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to feel his feet again his his only complaint was that it wore off but you
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do have to use more I myself was astonished too at the rapidity of this
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particular intervention for him so progesterone and um all of the
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neurosteroids are made Den noo in the brain from cholesterol there’s a whole
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independent hormone Factory going on up there fortunately these hormones do
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cross the blood brain barrier again if you use it Exogen it will make a
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difference particularly to mood things headaches are are easily remedied with
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with progesterone progesteron an aromatase inhibitor and a five Alpha reductase
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inhibitor we’ll go into that a little bit a mass cells we’re talking about um
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Mass Cell Activation Syndrome all of a sudden and what a big problem this is so I
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immediately go to the literature and see how hormones are involved well guess what there is estrogen dominance
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happening in mass cells when there’s histamine re uh released progesterone is
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a hormone which has an antihistamine activity it keeps that excessive
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estrogen in check inside the mass cells we have particularly after menopause we
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we have intracrinology inside the cells there is a whole hormone Factory and
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this is what we’re dependent on particularly postmenopausal and progesterone even
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though its structure doesn’t predict it is a strong
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antioxidant so here are some of the other problems contributing to this
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estrogen dominance issue um methylation
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deficiencies uh we get uh more attention being paid to our ability to methylate
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which is a detoxification process and interesting enough both
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estrogens and adrenaline require methylation for
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detoxification we have recirculation of our own hormones when we have a
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disordered microbiome that produces beta glucuronidase that enzyme will cleave
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off a conjugated estrogen and put it right back into circulation so you can
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have a buildup of your own estrogens your own Factory keeps Recycling and
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building up xenoestrogens outside sources insecticides
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pesticides many of which have have been documented to have estrogen
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activity metalloestrogens is the class of estrogen like activity produced by
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heavy metals such as mercury um then we have um later we’ll
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talk about this a little more uh fungus candida some organisms produce 17 beta
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estrad um endometriosis this growth of uterine
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endomet type tissue outside the uterus
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was um thought by by the um candida people
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um that endometriosis has a strong link to being caused by this fungal
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overgrowth glyphy has been um has estrogenic activity so if uh you’re
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tending to be a vegetarian look out for the the glyphed in your plant food um if you’re a meat
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eater uh some of the animals are implanted with hormones deliberately to to make them
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grow faster and there they are estrogens and and test androgens like testosterone
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and synthetics and can be just be 17 beta estradi so it’s in your
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food so um I want to introduce you to Dr plechner Dr Al plechner he was a vet and
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he’s written a number of Articles and books and he discovered uh by looking at
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total estrogens versus IG IGM
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IGA and beta cells the immute cells would be all all of those molecules
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would be low with total estrogen high and some some believe that total
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estrogens are just a reflection of estradi and estrone Dr plechner felt
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that there were also some other estrogens contributing to to this load
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of estrogen and he thought they were coming from the adrenal glands um I’ve
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talked to lab people I can’t I can’t get good information on what all that total
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estrogen uh lab result tells you but what Dr pner found when you had this
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High total estrogen with the very low immune
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molecules that hydrocortisone could be used to treat
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and he he was very successful in treating a chronic disease and dogs that caused blindness he
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also treated so-called treated about 2,000 and humans because he felt environmental
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issues were a strong um cause of this imbalance and where the pet was the
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human was and he could find analogous situations in humans and by uh treating
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with hydrocortisone you you could just completely change the situation I would
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submit but he never did that perhaps uh progesterone would also work we don’t know Dr pner has passed away
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now uh very interesting ideas and he’s written a lot which is still
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available so now we have uh Dr Platt who’s written a very interesting book
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called adrenaline dominance and we have a whole number of
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symptoms that uh are associated with high adrenaline so one of the things I
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started to wonder about the so-called estrogen Kickback situation with using
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low progesterone there was also a component of heart palpitations Panic uh
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women running to the emergency room with low doses of progesterone and I started to think that
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these symptoms sounded more like adrenaline than they sounded like estrogen and I think this estrogen
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Kickback picture is bigger than just the estrogen I think there’s this adrenaline
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component now adrenaline is in charge of keeping your blood glucose
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normal and when you drop into a hypoglycemic State your adrenaline will
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go up it may take cortisol up with it or it may not if you’re not able to make
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more of the cortical steroids it may not bring it up too but anyway you have the
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adrenaline now we have the situation where there are many of us and they
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think as much as 40% have methylation issues so you have this High
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adrenaline uh surge but you may not be able to get rid of it very easily so
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then what uh one of the problems that
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many facei is good sleep and I believe it was Melvin Paige
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he was one of the endocrinologist dentists from around the 1930s who had
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wonderful endocrine insights and this was called liver
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insomnia and what what happened is if you would wake at say 3 or 4 o’clock in
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the morning and not be able to go back to sleep you’re mind was busy and uh you
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just couldn’t settle and rest if this was going on Dr Paige advised that you put an
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apple by your bedside and eat an apple because your blood glucose was down
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adrenaline was up and while this adrenaline was high because it was trying to get more glucose to your brain
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uh you would not be able to sleep and sure enough if you give patients that advice and they eat an apple they can
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fall right back asleep um if this is what’s going on this further points to the liver not
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being able to store enough glycogen for the night so there’s not only the adrenaline issue there’s a liver issue
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that should be looked at if this is this is what’s
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happening here’s here’s a slide here’s a study um
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glycate directly impacts the alpha receptors for estrogen which are which
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is the stronger this is where estradi is attracted so it has a strong influence
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on estrogen type
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activity here is uh an article about the Schwan cells as I was mentioning
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mentioning before pregnanolone and progesterone um are produced
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independently not really measurable but do help uh this situation
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which a nerve tissue is not getting enough
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progesterone I’m throwing this in because I didn’t mention it earlier but I came across this with my theory about
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you can look up just about everything and ask yourself What’s the hormone connection
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and sure enough with covid-19 um reverses hypoxia stabilizes blood
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pressure controls thrombosis balances electrolytes reduces viral load
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regulation of immune responses this quite dramatic there’s also studies
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published that I’ve seen with hydrocortisone being particularly low in
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those postco long covid vaccine damaged people um so this Co close correlation
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with Cortisone and progesterone is probably a key something to look at and
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measure uh if if this is going on here’s the mass cell secretion as I
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mentioned before there’s a I found a whole cluster of Articles if you have this imbalance inside the mass cell
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degranulation is going to occur more often leaving you with histamine release and histamine
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symptoms so I just wanted to point out a few
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symptoms that are associated with hormone problems which we asthma and allergies
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hot fleshes per menopausal symptoms um anxiety
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floating recurrent migraines and dizziness insomnia uh one of my clients
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said to me um she’s getting uh stomach
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aches well we know there’s a lot of histamine uh receptors in the stomach we
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have H2 blocker drugs like
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Tagamet interesting so are you looking for stomach aches for a hormone
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disorder here’s another complication with sex hormone binding globulin and I
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put this in here here because I think we should pay attention we have many hypotheses in this this field of
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hormones and they don’t all hold up all the time and here’s one we’ve been
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pretty much taught don’t even look at sex hormone binding and and uh total hormones
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because that’s not available to the cells but there is a study to show that
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there’s a protein shuttle megalin that will bring the whole complex the bound
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hormone with sex hormone binding globulin right into the cell here’s a little graphic for it so you can’t
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discount these um this carrier protein which can be bringing in more estrogen
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more testosteron then you really realize into the
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cell okay five lha reductase as I said progesterone um
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is uh will U be a five Alpha reductase inhibitor and this is a theory about how
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it works progesterone also is acted upon with five Alpha
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reductase and it offers alternative substrate to testosterone so that’s how
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it might its action might be could be others we don’t
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know I just wanted to point out one Finas right procar Propecia look how
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close it looks to the progesterone molecule so I I submit to you why are we
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submitting people to toxic drugs like finasteride there lawsuits going on with
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young men with um uh trying to treat their their hair balding and they lose
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all sexual interests they’re depressed they’re suicidal where you could be
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using progesterone which which is the hormone inside that should be working
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inside our body and doing that exact
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activity so I want to spend some time on candida because this
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causes all sorts of problems when you’re trying to use
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progesterone I think I saw this in John troi’s book the yeast syndrome that cand
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will flourish in the presence of extra progesterone testosterone
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Hydrocortisone and this is indeed my experience when I was working at Women’s
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International we had really good results with progesterone but there would be women who didn’t have good
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results and I finally um tried to sort
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this out why was this happening and one of the biggest is issues that I
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discovered was underlying candida overgrowth so when you get all these uh
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other symptoms if you take take a look at some of these things you’ll also see
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that so when you have somebody that you’ve identified as being imbalanced
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with too much estrogen effect and you want to use progesterone and you’ve get these signs
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of candida overgrowth showing up uh something to pay attention to my
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suggestion is that you get on top of the candida first give patients the ability
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to uh control that candida overgrowth and then use use the hormones maybe a
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little bit more cautiously than otherwise maybe pregnanolone as the
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First Choice rather than progesterone or some other techniques
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so I just want to uh show that that there are so many of interesting
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different symptoms when candida is part of the
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picture um things on your skin I’m always looking for um two Dr William
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crook who wrote the yeast syndrome and the yeast syndrome of the woman I had a personal conversation with him and he
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said one of the problems that candida produces is microt toxins are being excreted through your
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skin and your vaginal tissue if you have any burning and
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itching uh symptoms always think candida well that might take you to uh to your
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doctor’s office but when they look for a yeast infection in the vaginal tissue
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there’s no yeast infection it’s not the yeast it’s a mot toxin coming from the
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overgrowth that’s seated in the gut
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so we should be looking for in the case of PMS we should be looking for underlying um candid overgrowth and um
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endometriosis is not on this list I put that there too a lot of postnasal
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drip chronic sinus in infections are considered to be fungal in nature um
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sometimes people get mistreated with antibiotics makes it worse
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um emotional issues are big with candida then here’s a big problem with fluid
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retention weight gain there’s a lot of complaints with um per menopause and
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menopause with weight gain after having eaten the same you’ve eaten for years
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had stable weight and all of a sudden you’re out of control this is one of the places to look but excessive estrogen
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can also be a problem just all by itself
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um here’s here’s more of the itching stuffy nose glass of wine causes here’s
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another um estrogen excess that I didn’t do a SL slide for but the um after one
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glass of wine your estral level can just shoot right up creating
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instability and I just put this in as a reference there used to be a group
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called The candida re research group and this was a um public group and they uh
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the exact collected all these articles and gave it to me and they were
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different organisms and what the
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um excuse me I’ll
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just I can’t do it
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uh what the organisms that these
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um what what things see the hormonal effect of each of these organisms and
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here’s the references I just put this in here as as having some references so
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people have some appreciation I uh after this original thing I um updated it some
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years ago but there’s a strong evidence of all this um organisms and some
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sometimes organisms that don’t belong there are creating hormonal issues there
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are organisms that can bind 17 beta estrad there are organisms that can
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create 17 beta
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estradi okay okay as an aromatase inhibitor
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I think this idea of okay we use some testosterone and testosterone is too
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much is aromatized to estrogen and that’s the
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problem with estrogen dominance you want the testosterone activity but you want
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to stop too much estrogen we’re we’re kind of forgetting that Aroma taste is
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increase when you have excessive glucocorticoid activity that may be your underlying problem that you should take
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a look at but progesterone is also a moderator of
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Aroma taste and should be considered rather rather than a Pharma drug as an
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alternative and here’s an interesting paper as a antioxidant increases
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antioxidant enzymes such as s so I thought and um found this vastly
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interesting in this particular paper um they talked about progesterone being
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a possibility for a lot of eye disorders macular degeneration um retinol Pigmentosa even
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uh quite quite interesting I mentioned Ray Pete before
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and uh he he was very prolific writer uh he wrote about four books and he had a
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newsletter well referenced and well thought out ever I took his newsletter
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for years and would always make my brain hurt because I had to reframe what I
41:36
thought I knew and if if this Set uh with what I knew or if it didn’t
41:43
but one of the things I’d like to point out here is vitamin
41:48
E I have another slide I think it’s it spares progesterone back where we have
41:54
the candida problem why not add some vitamin E to to this
42:00
situation and there’s another thing that Ray Pete
42:07
rather brought up and it’s being taken up by by some of the um people on the
42:12
Facebook groups that prolactin could be a measure of
42:20
tissue estrogen prolactin will go up and does go up in the presence of excess
42:27
estrogen in the presence of hypothyroidism so um this can be treated
42:34
with progesterone if this is the case progesterone will bring down prolactin a
42:39
vitamin E will bring down prolactin um this is an interesting
42:45
thought we’re taught that estrogen is needed for the bones
42:50
under this particular pathway with its increase in prolactin excess estrogen
42:59
could have a negative effect on your bone
43:05
turnover here’s the uh vitamin vitamin E Dr Pete also liked aspirin for
43:15
this and then back to intracrinology from circulating DHEA inside the cell we
43:23
have the whole hormone Factory going on and this also can be disregulated but um
43:29
we can also use exogenous hormones to help correct
43:35
it okay so back to our case study so what do we do with with this
43:43
woman who has been diagnosed with pmdd and she doesn’t even want to take for
43:50
gester she took 100 milligrams once at bedtime and uh she
43:56
thought she was going to die she had terrific panic attacks she went to the
44:01
hospital had all her cardiovascular um stuff checked out and
44:07
was told there’s nothing wrong with her but she she somehow knows now that she
44:13
is sensitive or progesterone doesn’t sit well with her in this case um some
44:20
somehow we have to get rid of that fear and you I put dose range as I mentioned
44:27
before with a severe pmss we started on 400 milligrams daily in divided Doses
44:34
and I’ve seen women as high as 2500 milligrams and this can be in one dosage
44:40
form various dosage forms um I think creams are sometimes a problem
44:48
the hormone uh progesterone hormone is suspended in a cream it’s not completely
44:55
dissolved so you have these particulate matter in that cream and in order to get
45:01
past the Skin Barrier a couple things have to happen it has to be dissolved you have to have skin oils to dissolve
45:09
that particulate the rest of it and you have to have good circulation to the Skin So if you happen to have a
45:18
hypothyroid patient both of these things are missing skin circulation is poor
45:23
there’s not enough oils you can have patients report they get um white powder
45:30
sitting on their skin well that’s not gone in uh it doesn’t matter how much
45:35
you think you’ve you’ve given so um oral progesterone can be good some proportion
45:43
of women make Alo pregnanolone with it and this causes a lot of drowsiness
45:49
equivalent to the drowsiness you can expect from phena Barb I think this has been responsible for the recommendation
45:57
by doctors all the time to take progesterone at bedtime now progesterone
46:02
can be a precursor to the aloe or it can be simply
46:08
um relaxing your mind um making making it possible for you to sleep and I think
46:15
that’s tied up into the balancing of adrenaline that progesterone can do so
46:22
um you can use vaginally uh it’s very good absorption
46:27
rectile is good absorption you can use Alternatives when when there’s too much drowsiness from progesterone you can do
46:34
that so given with some of the other things I’ve talked about um stabilizing insulin and glucose
46:43
and identifying food sensitivities because you can have a glycemic response
46:51
to proteins if you’re sensitive to it there’s there’s a a uh pathway for that so you want to
47:00
look at that first insulin glucosa your most primitive hormones your strongest
47:07
hormones and I believe with this large incidence of insulin resistance in our
47:14
population that we’re seeing more and more of this another little Pearl I heard from a colleague was she had a
47:22
client who was using a continuous glucose mon Monitor and when when she
47:28
had a hot flash her glucose monitor would give her a reading of
47:33
50 um quite a quite a dramatic drop so something to think about for these these
47:40
uh what we normally attribute to estrogen rising or falling or or
47:46
whatever a methylation groups um you can you can use methylated bees you can use
47:51
Bane Sam e but you need the methylation groups for
47:58
detoxification as well as sulfur the glutathione and sulfurane and um NAC you
48:06
need you need H sulfur for conjugating estrogens remove heavy
48:12
metals as I mentioned before this is also a source of estrogenic activity by
48:18
activating the estrogen receptor use antihistamines now some of the
48:24
literature will say you know use Zer um zerch and use taged as antihistamines um
48:32
I would say remember vitamin C here vitamin C is a strong antihistamine and
48:37
of course progesterone as you you’ve just we’ve just said we’re going to give her lots of it vitamin E uh because it
48:46
spares the progesterone maybe you can get get by on less sauna for the
48:53
xenoestrogens um decreases supplemental estrogen uh you may have these patients
49:00
you’ve had a hysterctomy they come to you on estrogen when you add
49:05
progesterone as I said that estrogen activity is intensified by whatever
49:11
mechanism it it really is John Lee this was a good piece of information I
49:17
thought recommended that you half the amount of estrogen being used when you
49:22
introduce progesterone what do I have down here I can’t see
49:29
okay salt uh to help your adrenals along with vitamin
49:34
cb5 enzymes for immune complexes that could be giving you issues U from food
49:41
sensitivities you can break this down with enzymes proteolytic enzymes um use
49:47
candida protocols and this is a conundrum for me there are so many techniques that um have been developed
49:55
to uh treat candida I do not know what the best is uh fiber uh Dr Pete
50:02
recommends the daily carrot salad a shredded carrot with vinegar and coconut
50:10
oil and then just the other day I heard an interesting thing about ozone I was
50:16
in a medical office and uh they have uh ozone
50:22
treatments and they had uh with in their disclaimer that ozone
50:29
could help detoxify
50:34
adrenaline uh and this this was being uh given to a young man who had pots and I
50:42
tried to find something down that rabbit hole what I found only was that in in
50:49
the case of low cellular oxygen adrenaline and estrad are not
50:56
metabolized very well so there might be a place for ozone in this this complex
51:03
patient I’d like to report just today I had a follow-up appointment with a woman
51:09
from the Netherlands that I’ve been in contact with for about a month and uh she is one
51:17
of these uh PMD deers she’s fortunately got her organs but she’s she’s been
51:24
drugged and she’s been able to uh start decreasing her anti-depressant she is
51:31
off her um a proton pump inhibitor so she can absorb her food
51:38
better she um I asked her she she’s uh
51:44
been treated with like retina for rosacea said your stomach acid will be
51:49
taken care of that now that you’re you’re supplementing with digestive enzymes anyway her mood uh in this
51:58
period since I saw her two weeks ago she’s she’s tremendously excited she’s
52:05
like uh 60 to 70% better she’s she’s not 100% but that’s what she wants she said
52:14
not I’ve come this far she said I want it all this this is a woman when I first
52:20
talked to her um didn’t think life was worth living I want to point out a
52:25
couple things I’ve been um I think there’s a progesterone conspiracy going on in the United
52:32
Kingdom uh family practice doctors can prescribe no more than 200 milligrams of
52:39
progesterone and something similar in the Netherlands um they can go up to 400
52:45
milligrams but when they’re prescribing more they they are already subject to
52:50
somebody questioning their practice so this is a problem for for this these
52:56
particular patients and I pointed out like a extreme
53:02
case but this is it’s it’s a Continuum some some women might do just fine on 50
53:10
milligrams per gestone or a 100 or 200 but there are many that need a lot
53:18
more so this is my hierarchy of hormones as I mentioned before insulin glucose
53:24
you’ve got to look at that so many people just Test the sex hormones there at the bottom adrenal hormones cortical
53:32
steroids we don’t have a test for adrenaline however
53:37
um Dr plat says do a morning cortisol and if it’s above a fasting morning
53:45
cortisol if it’s above 11.5 um consider that adrenaline is
53:51
right up there and it’s a hyper adrenaline situation a thyroid will not work well if you
53:58
don’t have the adrenal base for it if your adrenals are insufficient and you
54:03
try to use thyroid you’ll get heart palpitations and intolerance and then
54:08
finally look at the sex hormones so this is a sunrise over bokan
54:15
Buu in Panama near Boke it’s it’s pretty cold morning up
54:21
there on the mountain but I love this group and and what people are trying to
54:27
do here trying to look at what we know and look try to um engage our colleagues
54:35
and find out who knows what and what pearls we can apply to the people we’re trying to help so right at the last I
54:43
have my contact information and I’d like everybody here to consider going to a4m
54:49
Forum there at the bottom forum.org right there please
54:56
participate and um I’ll I’ll try to get this lecture posted there and love to
55:02
have your input um on that particular case if you have ideas and other things
55:08
you’ve seen in your own practice I’d love to see it so that’s it thank
55:20
you hi Carol this Dr Patel how are you thank you good good
55:28
it’s it’s excellent excellent thank you very much I appreciate that coming from you
55:40
yeah now what do you suggest for the women we start on the HRT on
55:45
progesterone and then they start having a little bits of bleeding um what do you what do you say
55:52
to these patients okay here’s here’s another possible
55:57
myth progesterone is a hormone that makes the endometrium
56:04
secretory so if you start progesterone and there’s a buildup when you have enough progesterone available to work
56:11
it’s going to shed it it’s a wonderful thing better out than
56:16
in um people back to the graph where I had the menstrual cycle and we’ all been
56:23
taught this that you don’t have bleeding until estradi and progesterone drop and
56:31
I my experience with working with the PM users they could H they could be as
56:38
regular as as Clockwork and they would have severe symptoms one two three days into
56:45
bleeding and the advice was keep stay on your high dose of progesterone well
56:52
guess what they bled right on top with right on time no drop in progesterone so
56:58
this is this is a conundrum people have in their minds that progesterone has to drop to bleed but when you put
57:06
progesterone in and it creates a secretory endometrium you’re going to
57:12
get rid of it and that’s a good thing warn your
57:23
patients so how long would they would they bleed then I think I think the function of of
57:31
how long they would bleed has something to do with how much progesterone you’ve given them so if they are like
57:40
spotting on whatever dose you’ve given them they could they could continue spotting for a long time if this is
57:48
coming up use a larger dose um get get the buildup taken care
57:55
of if somebody has been progesterone deficient for for a long time and you’re starting progesterone let them know they
58:03
could have a a large bleed could be quite substantial for that first
58:13
bleed if you stop the progesterone the bleeding can stop but you still have the endometrial lining still stuck and
58:23
enlarged
58:33
Carol what about for patients who you give progesterone just progesterone itself and then suddenly they have
58:41
reaction these are these are barest when I see them patients they get sick dizzy
58:46
is that related to the progesterone or more of the imbalance because it they were not given estrogen as well okay um
58:55
as as I showed on on several things it can be it can be this estrogen Kickback
59:02
it can be how the progesterone is metabolized I I have a Blog on my
59:07
website uh when women don’t like progesterone and there’s numerous reasons I put together and something to
59:15
investigate the biggest reason that they do have problems with progesterone is
59:20
underdosing probably the next biggest is Candida issues so when you you’re
59:26
talking about dizziness brain fog I’d look for
59:34
candid yeah I have this precise patient that has recurrent candida vaginitis and
59:41
I gave her a bit of progesterone and she felt so dizzy and vertiginous she couldn’t tolerate it and so we stomped
59:47
it but uh interesting candida huh yeah so I would like I I said for this
59:54
patient and and I did say it once Tri pregnenolone instead has less impact
1:00:01
probably on the um uh blood sugar issues there’s also
1:00:07
suppression of some of the immune components with progesterone and that
1:00:12
allows a woman to carry an alien fetus that same suppression immune system
1:00:18
suppression like a pregnancy can also not recognize or or allow the candy to
1:00:25
to flourish that’s the only two reasons I found with progesterone um allowing that candida to
1:00:33
flourish there may be more but those are the only two I found are you in favor of doing ebl for
1:00:42
Canada or you rather do this naturally um what can you can you repeat
1:00:47
a little bit longer are you in favor of doing antifungals for candida or you
1:00:52
rather treat this naturally um you’re talking about probiotics and
1:00:59
diet yeah yeah and well kill the candida with st chain fatty acids or oregano
1:01:07
garlic um I I can’t really say say what works Dr Morton
1:01:13
teach um treats uh candy excessively in in New York City and what
1:01:20
he uses is his nice Statin and every orifice a lot of it he said he’s the biggest prescriber of nice satin in the
1:01:27
US and he’s gotten some results some people say unless if you have heavy
1:01:32
metals unless you uh take care of the heavy metal problem you’re always going to have a Candida problem um I’ve heard
1:01:41
arguments on both sides of that so it might be something to look into as well but you do have to do something so you
1:01:49
your patient can manage that uh once they are on hormones particularly testost
1:01:54
testosterone uh testosterone is needed for Ev protein synthesis in your body
1:02:01
every single protein and it will strengthen your immune system so something also to look at it has an
1:02:09
impact on candida flourishing too but much less than the progesterone
1:02:16
does what was the name of your website again it’s the wellness by design
1:02:23
project okay thank you so Carol don’t you think then that
1:02:28
may be a good idea when there’s a question about uh big question about
1:02:34
problem with candida one can use progesterone to
1:02:40
see makes patient worse yeah as a diagnostic yeah absolutely it a diagnos
1:02:48
it it totally will it will out it out
1:02:54
yeah and the biggest symptoms tend to be gastrointestinal changes whether it’s
1:03:00
constipation or diarrhea and and the head stuff the brain fog and the sinus
1:03:06
stuff really pop up really quickly and they may be also anxious depressed yes
1:03:14
yeah right right so what about that progesterone which is over the
1:03:20
counter okay for the for the most um like like proest which I mentioned
1:03:25
before 16 milligrams per dose prenol um 30 milligrams perose for many
1:03:34
these these doses are much too small there are a number of companies out there I’ve got them on my website that
1:03:42
have over-the-counter products 50 milligrams per dose 75 milligrams 100
1:03:47
milligrams per dose 200 milligrams per dose um Quicksilver scientific has
1:03:54
smaller doses but the it’s it’s exceptionally well absorbed so um you have a lot of
1:04:01
over-the-counter opportunities for progesterone now as I mentioned UK and Netherlands they don’t have this
1:04:08
available these women are desperately trying to get products from the US to
1:04:13
help um boost up their ability to have more progesterone is quite
1:04:21
appalling can you make a comment the pharmacist for my patients who want to get their progesterone commercially
1:04:29
because their insurance might cover it you discuss a little bit the difference that you could get maybe at Walgreens
1:04:35
versus maybe some of the compounded progesterones okay so there are
1:04:41
um um I just it’s blown out of my mind
1:04:46
there’s a vaginal progesterone that’s FDA approved commercially I think it’s
1:04:51
50 milligrams or 75 milligram dose and then your choices the capsules
1:04:57
prometrium and generic so with compounding you have all sorts of
1:05:03
options now everything is all the same molecules the bioidentical hormones
1:05:09
whether it’s an FDA product it’s a um compounded product it’s an
1:05:15
over-the-counter product it has to be so it’s all in the regulation of the FDA um
1:05:21
as as far as a pure and clean drug apply to the to the country that’s part of its
1:05:27
basic functioning which I think is a good thing so uh compounding you get the options of um dosage variability you can
1:05:36
do creams gels you can do suppositories all sorts of
1:05:43
lenes all sorts of different dosage forms and you’re G to find like I
1:05:48
mentioned with the creams if you had a hypothyroid person the cream might not be your best gel might be better because
1:05:55
the progesterone’s already dissolved if you have a clear gel or um you might
1:06:00
want to do a um a vaginal suppository
1:06:05
you might want to insert a capsule vaginally um all all sorts of
1:06:10
opportunities the really wonder about compounding is it’s endless what you can do with with those options but you know
1:06:18
a couple times I prescribe progesterone at the Walgreens but then what the patient shows me in the office is something called a mroy progesterone can
1:06:26
you describe well that’s a serious
1:06:31
mistake yeah it’s not what I ordered but that’s what we got oh my God so uh it’s
1:06:38
a synthetic analog and it’s quite it’s been quite popular and uh it would be
1:06:45
interesting to have a side bys side comparison one of the interesting things about mroy progesterone acetate um is
1:06:53
it’s water soluble it’s not fat soluble but think about the implications for that in your body as your body
1:07:00
compartmentalizes different things but many it it does help shed uterine lining
1:07:07
yes um although it might not be as efficient as progesterone I’ve heard of cases women had been on that started
1:07:14
progesterone all of a sudden have a really heavy bleed because it simply wasn’t working well enough but many of
1:07:20
the progesterone activities that I put up there you would really like to have
1:07:26
the antihistamine antioxidant um aromatase inhibitor uh the synthetic
1:07:31
mroy progesterone acetate does not do that or it doesn’t do all those positive
1:07:36
things so that was the progestin used in the Women’s Health Initiative um it it actually is
1:07:44
demonstrated even before that study has been demonstrated as being stroke
1:07:49
inducing uh it’s a rather a dangerous thing to be using I think it to be off the market but it still
1:08:00
persists oh one of the things that we we teach in in APM just in response to
1:08:06
stefans uh progesterone in your regular CVS or
1:08:11
Pharmacy usually are noted to be short acting types of progesterone so when we’re talking about sleep induction uh
1:08:18
that’s a big factor and when I mean not all but when you do a compounded version of proest on it’s usually e4m or
1:08:26
extended release and this is something that we usually use for the ones who like sustain sleep in terms of waking up
1:08:34
in the middle of the night for the initiation of sleep the the prometrium is is a is a more I mean useful product
1:08:42
and also it’s covered by insurance for patients so it’s it’s just more accessible compared to the compounded
1:08:49
progesterone and this is oral that I’m pertaining to right um many years ago at Women’s we
1:08:56
did a PK study with our progesterone in oil and we compared it to somebody it
1:09:03
was a compounded time release tablet somebody was compounding we compared it
1:09:09
to that and what we saw was they both dropped off at about six
1:09:15
hours and uh the area under the curve for the time release was less than the
1:09:23
capsu in oil so we we saw no reason to do the the Tim release so when you’re
1:09:29
using the Tim release um formulation do you know what sort of uh blood levels
1:09:35
you’re getting with that have you checked uh where just car yeah no uh
1:09:44
well most of the time we use Ur testing okay to to level so we look at the
1:09:51
alalon so I see a lot of my patients really bumping that Al
1:09:57
downon higher with the the oral prestal I mean you mentioned about the vaginal
1:10:04
and also the Y yep exactly right so I I don’t have a number
1:10:10
but we usually have that I’m sure you know Dutch so that yeah the gauge there
1:10:17
usually kind of shows that effect for us and Carol you just mentioned while
1:10:23
ago you said that when patients are bleeding you bump the progesterone higher rather than because the tendency
1:10:29
is on the clinicians would stop everything until the bleeding stops but you’re saying let the bleeding stop then
1:10:36
increase the progesterone or increase the progesterone while they’re bleeding um you have that option to increase
1:10:42
while they’re bleeding it’s already started the process of shedding and if
1:10:47
you want to get a more efficient shed you’d go up and definitely as I mention
1:10:54
if you stop you’re going to stop that process you’re not going to be bleeding but the O the um overgrown endometrium
1:11:02
still is there so if you want to speed it up if your dose of progesterone is lower you might not bleed as heavily but
1:11:09
it’ll take longer to get rid of it so you have an extended bleed so when you when you add it a
1:11:17
little bit more you’re going to hasten the process and then for the longer term of things you’re not going to have
1:11:23
bleeding at all right right once that happens now now you know your
1:11:29
endometrium is cleared and your ground zero whatever your therapy is going to be done if
1:11:35
you’re going to cycle or a steady state um you at least have you know that then
1:11:42
uh then you have a situation let’s say you were using some estradi progesterone every day whatever dosage form
1:11:49
everything’s hunky dory and all of a sudden there’s bleeding spotting what’s going
1:11:54
on um so what’s happened if you ask and this has been my experience like 100% of
1:12:01
the time ask for some sort of stress sometime just prior to this
1:12:07
bleeding incident whether it’s going on vacation or often I hear some really
1:12:12
Dreadful family situations during this time here’s here’s where the
1:12:17
pregnanolone steel or or simply progesterone converting to cortisol to
1:12:23
deal with the stress when that’s happening there’s no longer enough progesterone to balance estrogen
1:12:29
estrogen becomes stimulant builds up a layer and then after a period when the
1:12:36
stress has dissipated progesterone will make that layer secretory and cause some bleeding
1:12:44
that’s the spotting and that’s a fairly common um thing that can happen you can
1:12:50
go for years and then all of a sudden have some spotting so always look for a
1:12:55
stress just prior and then um by the time spotting is occurring the problems
1:13:01
corrected itself and you could do the same thing you could use a little more make sure you get rid of all the
1:13:08
endometrial tissue that’s built up you can you can just let it let it continue
1:13:14
till it’s finished whatever you
1:13:22
want
1:13:41
Carol do you have any idea about uh when the young girls they uh stop their
1:13:49
period uh under stress and then two years and have no
1:13:55
period um usually GYN will put them on on the
1:14:03
birth control pills and they don’t feel good so how would you approach that well this this
1:14:10
is really interesting um have you heard of uh Dr Jerry ly prior at University of British
1:14:16
Columbia she’s uh she studied osteoporosis she’s studied um cycling um
1:14:23
she’s got a wonderful website semor cem co.ca a lot of lot of information and a
1:14:31
lot of about what she’s been studying but highly athletic women first they lose progesterone and
1:14:39
then they even lose estrogen so what what are you g to do with them um you could um the the first
1:14:47
thing you should do is always use progesterone first to um rep replenish the
1:14:53
progesterone and then bolster estrogen activity for whatever estrogen you have
1:15:00
uh compet Sports competition is a big drain on the adrenal glands so using
1:15:05
progesterone in that case you could um in the case of young girls you could set
1:15:11
up a cycling situation where you use some progesterone month long but you use
1:15:17
um a larger amount for the ludal phase so it really depends on what kind of
1:15:22
stress they’re continuously experiencing but my experience with dealing with
1:15:28
younger women with PMS uh when I first started I thought
1:15:33
PMS would be forever and it wasn’t because I started talking to many women who said I used to
1:15:42
get progesterone for PMS and everything cleared up so I
1:15:48
stopped and now that I’m per menopausal age those same symptoms are are coming
1:15:54
back so I surmised that using progesterone and cycling progesterone
1:16:00
was able to give the pituitary the signals that they could correct LH FSH
1:16:08
could correct and and they had normal Cycles so I get what I would recommend
1:16:14
is is try to reestablish a normal cycle with with natural
1:16:22
hormones Carol are you familiar with the just
1:16:27
there’s the group out there that’s when they use hormone therapy in postmenopausal women they use high doses
1:16:34
and they make them bleed yeah and this is perceived by this group as actually a
1:16:40
good sign and even I heard some of these these meetings and patients were raving
1:16:46
about having menstration at at 70 uh just because of these high doses
1:16:53
of hormones I don’t know if um what are your thoughts on that yeah it’s really
1:16:58
quite interesting I I did an N1 study for for three months myself to see what
1:17:04
it felt like and uh I was I was experiencing some weight gain which I didn’t like
1:17:10
however you know you go up to like a dose of 16 milligrams of estradi and it it feels wonderful
1:17:19
actually so I I can see that and they do also accordingly they do some very high
1:17:24
doses of progesterone so the question is for for long term is that a good natural
1:17:31
situation um I would say yes yes and no
1:17:36
um what there’s what’s his name Don Colbert um has written I never I never
1:17:43
met him but he’s written a number of books I’ve read several of his books and
1:17:49
uh he had been using hormone Therapies in his practice bioidentical for many
1:17:55
years and and one of his later books he said he started using hormones in larger
1:18:02
amounts but not in the amounts that we’re talking about Wy protocol which I think is is really high but he said like
1:18:09
for himself for example testosterone he was using testosterone supplemental and felt
1:18:16
pretty good but he bumped it up so he would be on the higher end of the range
1:18:23
and he said um my Decades of psoriasis just disappeared and he started giving
1:18:29
his patients more generous dosing of the hormones than he had previously and uh was reporting some
1:18:37
really excellent results it’s very interesting book and I think that he’s got a good point like what where is the
1:18:45
optimal for this okay so you sleep better and uh no hot
1:18:51
flashes um you’re comfortable you’re not you deal with stress okay is that your
1:18:57
optimal point or could you be even better so I think the Wy would protocol
1:19:03
would say you could be better I I don’t know um Suzanne Summers uh embrac the Wy
1:19:11
protocol and I know for a fact that she she had a hysterectomy because heavy
1:19:17
endometrial buildup now this made no sense to me because she should have
1:19:23
working with people who uh knew how to deal with that and help her shed that so
1:19:28
it’s it’s it’s weird to me that that happened um so so I don’t know but def
1:19:36
definitely some high doses at Women’s c naal pharmacy by the way the the highest
1:19:41
dose of estr dial we ever dispense was 50 milligrams per gram in a
1:19:47
cream and this woman uh fortunately worked for a physician’s office and they
1:19:52
could test her all the time it wasn’t until she got to that level that she had
1:19:59
first of all a blood level and second of all she felt okay uh later I theorized
1:20:06
that maybe she had some overgrowth of one of the fungal things that binds us to dial or maybe it was poor absorption
1:20:14
with with the cream I don’t know but that was the dose where she finally felt good well normally doctors wouldn’t even
1:20:21
entertain that kind of dosing but she she was able to get it
1:20:26
because of her situation yeah they sometimes don’t
1:20:32
absorb trans derly you can get injectable estrad cypionate from tailor
1:20:37
made Pharmacy it works pretty well yeah when you’re when you’re doing an injectable you’re you’re ensured that
1:20:44
the absorption is there I mean it’s completely absorbed hey Carol if I may ask um
1:20:53
what’s your uh diet what do you eat
1:20:58
me you know as a volunteer with Dr Clearfield you know I I that’s all I
1:21:04
hear is hormones all the time and I think food is huge stephon’s done some
1:21:09
excellent classes with red meat and I’ve gone back and forth really curious what
1:21:16
you think okay that’s that’s another place I’m really I’ve been delving in into
1:21:21
stuff for long time I’d like to just point out for the pmss the PMD ders the
1:21:28
per menopausal women K Katarina dalson recognized the hypoglycemic nature of
1:21:36
what they were doing right and she um
1:21:41
recommended eating every three hours which now we don’t usually do that
1:21:47
we’re more inclined to like restrict carbohydrates do more fats and proteins
1:21:52
this woman I was Consulting with today um I first did recommend her to
1:22:00
eat every three hours and it made a tremendous difference to her and then they said send me your food diary and
1:22:06
she’s a hypothyroid her test said L and I said let’s see what progesterone will do for your thyroid it might bring it
1:22:14
back up before we make a change there but she her diet was full of nuts and
1:22:19
seeds and uh wheat and and and and yogurt and I said you know uh quite a
1:22:26
lot of what you’re doing is thyroid suppress I’d like you to be more
1:22:32
Paleolithic that uh that helped her improve even further which I think is is
1:22:38
really positive I like the idea of being metabolically
1:22:43
um versatile that you’re able to go to fat burning to glucose burning pretty
1:22:49
easily your body can can be resilient I just heard uh somebody sent me a video
1:22:55
about how important protein is particularly the first meal of the day
1:23:01
like um like you should have about one gram of protein per pound of ideal body
1:23:08
weight but at least 30 grams at breakfast and had all kinds of positive documented stuff on triglycerides and
1:23:15
Insulin glucose just that one thing having sufficient protein and in at breakfast and what are people eating
1:23:22
oatmeal I oatmeal and toast and a piece of fruit
1:23:28
um so I went to a low carb USA
1:23:33
meeting and I was totally impressed with many many of the presenters at this
1:23:40
meeting were some of the fittest people I’ve ever seen on a stage presenting um
1:23:47
and some interesting things like um their LDL these marathoners good shaped
1:23:54
people uh LDL was Skyhigh like 800 so we’re trying to we’re trying to suppress
1:24:02
LDL um like why do we really know what we’re doing we don’t we we don’t we
1:24:07
don’t have a clue so I personally I bounced around
1:24:13
from trying to be keto doing um some fasting like pretty much I tend to eat
1:24:20
two meals a day yeah um try I really don’t want a snack um I also avoid
1:24:29
eating at night because um I was able to interview Jamie
1:24:35
Kaufman the chronic cough Enigma she says uh you’re you’re coughing at night
1:24:42
you’ve got postnasal drip and it’s it’s actually a form of acid
1:24:47
reflex that you’re getting from eating too soon be and going to bed too soon as
1:24:52
you’re getting that backed up and it’s making you cough and sure enough if you wait at least five hours it goes
1:25:00
away yeah peace um I do my best to work with
1:25:06
as many veterans as possible and a lot of us have insomnia it’s like across the board most all of us and I’ve got this
1:25:15
new acupuncturist that I’ve been working with and she got me onto this new book heal your metabolism I think was 2015
1:25:24
2017 and she want when I wake up in the middle of the night you know the one 1
1:25:29
to three time frame she wants me to get up and eat a little bit of protein and a little bit of food and it’s kind of
1:25:37
worked a little bit it’s been it’s been pretty amazing I’ll be honest because I don’t eat at night either I try to eat
1:25:43
four or before five but now I’m kind of sneaking in some stuff and it seems to be working it’s kind of amazing to be
1:25:50
honest that book has INSP ins spired by Ray pet work yes it is exactly exactly
1:25:57
agree and he’s the carrot salad he allows orange juice and uh cocacola with
1:26:03
cane sugar um he he said you do need carbohydrates right some some
1:26:12
yeah EXC I I have heard some people report there’s a forum a rape Forum
1:26:19
right some people have done amazingly well with following his guidelines some people not
1:26:28
right thank you so much oh thank
1:26:40
you and we do let’s see let’s see and we do have one question in the chat what is the ideal ratio of estrogen to
1:26:49
Progesterone you know what I I I have a mental block against thinking
1:26:56
about ratios because one thing you know about hormones are never the same if you took
1:27:02
a blood draw five minutes later it’s it’s not going to be the same um I would
1:27:08
say sufficient to have no symptoms that’s the ratio you need to be at um
1:27:15
enough progesterone or other aids to balance any excess estrogen my my idea
1:27:23
for for treating people is use progesterone use it liberally and get to a point of comfort
1:27:31
and then take that patient through the process like where is all this
1:27:36
estrogen stimulation coming from do we need detoxification do we need to clear
1:27:42
up the teeth do we need to change the microbiome there’s so many things that
1:27:48
can be um causing the problem but let’s let’s do it from a point of comfort
1:27:53
rather than misery Carol are you comfortable seeing um cancer patients with PR positive
1:28:01
receptors and being uh I mean being used on with progesterone by clinicians I
1:28:08
have seen it before I just don’t know if in your experience you saw that so um you’re you’re ask if it’s PR
1:28:14
positive if you should use progesterone or restrict it yeah because um I have seen
1:28:20
clinicians do it regarding regard less of yeah positivity or negativity on the receptor and the premise there is they
1:28:28
always know that progesterone is always um yeah negating estrogen is and also of
1:28:36
course being more protective in relation to the hyper effects of estrogen that in your yeah and and it’s
1:28:44
got an effect on the p7 gene which encourages apoptosis i’ like to um I’d like to
1:28:51
point out if you look a progesterone in in breast cancer for instance you can find studies that show
1:29:00
that progesterone has a negative effect actually allows the breast cancer to
1:29:06
grow more and I I would say in the case of fibroids as well if you
1:29:13
underdose progesterone you could get this estrogen
1:29:18
Kickback phenomenon that I was speaking about earlier and actually make the situation worse so I think you need if
1:29:26
you’re going to do it don’t do it timidly do do plenty of it um there are
1:29:33
also are studies to show that if you are progesterone receptor positive um progesterone is more uh this
1:29:40
was John Lee way back when he said progesterone is more likely to work and
1:29:45
um in general women have a more positive outcome if that indeed is the case there
1:29:51
was some some interesting stuff done with endometrial cancer I think it was at the University of uh California San
1:29:59
Diego they noted with endometrial cancer and we used to treat endometrial cancer
1:30:05
with progesterone with quite a large success rate as it turns out in their their abstract and they had studies but
1:30:12
what they were looking at were progesterone receptors and they noted
1:30:18
that as the cancer worsened the uh number of receptors
1:30:23
declined and what they were proposing to do was to have a test for progesterone
1:30:30
receptors and that would tell you how bad the cancer has gotten or how bad it
1:30:35
is when you first stage it I found that a really interesting concept about the
1:30:42
uh diminishment of The receptors and wonder if it’s not got an analogous situation breast cancer but I don’t
1:30:50
know
1:31:26
okay just in case uh Dr hassa is knocked out he made he made myself co-host L
1:31:35
other co-host so is there any other questions or does anybody have anything
1:31:41
else for um Carol
1:31:47
Peterson I think it was an excellent class and I know Dr clar Phi would definitely approve of it he’s probably
1:31:54
not he’s probably himself so thank you for the class um
1:32:01
someone recorded it I’m hoping it was shell Stein and if he did he does have
1:32:08
access and he knows how to send it via email it was you yep I got it yes
1:32:16
excellent okay so if anybody wants to sh’s a person to get a hold of
1:32:23
yeah well I my place the post it thank you sh appreciate
1:32:30
it all right and I think with that we’ll uh probably end the uh Zoom thank you